When is a ST not a ST anymore ?

General discussions or ideas about hardware.
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exxos
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Re: When is a ST not a ST anymore ?

Post by exxos » Fri Jul 20, 2018 1:23 pm

Shifter is of course a problem as less and less TV's support low ST resolutions. Though FPGA means code can be changed in future, and likely be alternative FPGA's over the years so in that respect FPGA is the only way forward. Even if breaks some tiny amount of software, as alternative is 100% compatible ST with no monitors to use it.

People like Wolfgang creating suska working on compatible cores, if community finds issues, he can update them. But his problem is nobody helping test anything... but as said before, I will start simple and test blitter first, shouldn't be any issues there, but will make sure 100% works before replacing other chips like MMU.
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Re: When is a ST not a ST anymore ?

Post by Steve » Fri Jul 20, 2018 2:23 pm

Petari, you don't seem to understand what I'm trying to put across comparing old cars to modern with old machines vs fpga. If you distill the idea to the bare necessities then when it comes to cars, the fact that they get you from A to B seems to be what you value the most based on your explanation. What I am saying is that the intricacies, the mechanical and physical make the beast, they make the experience more than just cerebral, they make them 'real'.

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Re: When is a ST not a ST anymore ?

Post by Petari » Fri Jul 20, 2018 9:32 pm

I don't think that nostalgia and soul are 2 things to even mention in same sentence. I really don't need to repeat and feel again my old experiences with old HW - like waiting 5 minutes that some SW load from tape. Or playing DJ with floppies. Not to mention that all it will cost more and more - to have working faithful copies of old technique. I'm sure that it is so great feeling to drive some restored sport car from 1931, and that it will make my life less miserable than it is now with all FPGA around :lol: Just send me some 100K $, and I will do my best to experience 'real' thing :arrow:
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Re: When is a ST not a ST anymore ?

Post by Darklord » Mon Jul 23, 2018 10:43 am

exxos wrote:
Thu Jul 19, 2018 7:09 pm
But if your whole STacy circuit was a "one chip wonder" in FPGA, is it still a STacy then ?
Yeah, that causes more head-scratching. :)

What if that same "one chip wonder" was then put into an original STacy
case? Would anyone know the difference if they didn't open it up? :)

I know people are going to yell at me but that's one reason I sold my MiST.
Technically innovative and amazing, it just wasn't an ST to me. :(
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Re: When is a ST not a ST anymore ?

Post by exxos » Mon Jul 23, 2018 11:16 am

Darklord wrote:
Mon Jul 23, 2018 10:43 am
Yeah, that causes more head-scratching. :)

What if that same "one chip wonder" was then put into an original STacy
case? Would anyone know the difference if they didn't open it up? :)

I know people are going to yell at me but that's one reason I sold my MiST.
Technically innovative and amazing, it just wasn't an ST to me. :(
It it was made with a "one chip wonder" and it was replaced by another "one chip wonder" then I be happy to say its the same.

I think to me, the ST's soul is part of it uses a Motorola 68000, YM sound chip etc. Of course it has custom Atari chips, though have to be replaced with FPGA if we want upgrades, or indeed able to use it on modern TVs as the "old ST" design is, as we know, problematic in terms of video.

Maybe it would be better to say its a evolution of the ST rather than "original". I mean Falcon is totally different machine, but mostly evolution of ST design.

My new ST project will be between the ST and Falcon, maybe call "STX" ( ST Extra, not STE, as already exists ). So may or may not be a "true ST" depends how people look at it, but if its a evolution of design, then can be classed as a "new ST". Because of course it is.
4MB STFM 1.44 FD- VELOCE+ 020 STE - 4MB STE 32MHz - STFM 16MHz - STM - MEGA ST - Falcon 030 CT60 - Atari 2600 - Atari 7800 - Gigafile - SD Floppy Emulator - PeST - HxC - CosmosEx - Ultrasatan - various clutter

https://www.exxoshost.co.uk/atari/ All my hardware guides - mods - games - STOS
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Re: When is a ST not a ST anymore ?

Post by Darklord » Mon Jul 23, 2018 12:41 pm

I'm surprisingly good with that. :)
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