Cooling TF cards in CD32

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Higgy
Posts: 147
Joined: Tue Apr 23, 2019 8:05 pm
Location: Somerset

Cooling TF cards in CD32

Post by Higgy » Thu Jun 11, 2020 8:51 pm

As recommended a topic on CD32 cooling (and a few bodges/tricks ;) )

Here is my cooling setup on the TF360. It is a 'Pi-Fan' 5V fan which I had around. I have the fan blowing onto the CPU, and you need the fan staged off the CPU or the air cant get out, it will just fight with the air coming in. So I had some little rubber feet from PS/2 keyboards I butchered ages ago. I cut the feet and superglued them to the four corners of the fan, then superglued that to the CPU:
cpu2.jpg
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There looks to be lots of height on the CD32, but not as much as you want :D Although my CPU is not fully inserted I would say there is no more than 20mm space available above the CPU. And you will have to lift off the cover to mount the TF card first. You will not be able to slide in/out (no big problem).
Because of the lack of height if using a heatsink it would have to be very low profile, so a heatsink+fan looks difficult. I think you select one or the other. I went for active cooling.

Regarding my trick to stage the CPU off the socket if you want to remove to test CPUs was as follows:
cpu1.jpg
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Place the CPU onto the socket first and engage the pins, then slide the card in (slide folded end in first). I used just thin card used in packaging which was in my bin. I cut them 2mm wide and folded them over. I inserted them so the cut height was between the CPU and socket and not the thickness of the card. (I hope that makes sense).
To be honest I don't know how far the CPU would sit in, but I just wanted more of a gap to assist in the removing my CPUs when checking them. Once you have done it a few times you get a feel for the pressure etc.

sugar
Posts: 71
Joined: Sat Apr 20, 2019 10:28 pm

Re: Cooling TF cards in CD32

Post by sugar » Thu Jun 11, 2020 10:22 pm

Thank you for the picture and the nice trick.

Looking at the CD32 the designed air flow is from the front grill and also the joystick connectors and exiting through the upper grills just over the TF. Having the expansion slot a bit open with a riser adds to that, so over all the CD32 is actually quite nicely ventilated. Now, I don't really understand much about these things but I would wager the best way would be to work with the natural air flow which would be force more air out the upper grill or perhaps push air towards the expansion slot.

Random ideas which are probably already used and obvious:
* Use a laptop blower to take air in through the upper grill and push it out towards the expansion slot, perhaps slightly to the right hand side
This would harm some air going out the top but should enhance the airflow and cool the cpu
* Add some small fans to the dead space tilted upwards to enhance the natural airflow. Might be a bit noisy because of the small fans and the fact that the airflow might be a bit forced.
* There's a screw hole near the card toward the front. Perhaps this can be used to fix something in place.

I'll probably try the laptop blower fan and I think a nice option would also be to have a 10mm integrated fan and heatsink if it fits, blowing up through the grills.

Danoo
Posts: 128
Joined: Wed Jan 29, 2020 1:25 pm
Location: Queensland, Australia

Re: Cooling TF cards in CD32

Post by Danoo » Mon Jun 15, 2020 12:46 pm

@Higgy Thanks for the temperature info in the other thread, our ambient temperature during the OZ summer can be well over 40 at times (cracked 44 last summer). It maybe time to invest in some air conditioning for my shed, if I want to run a TF360 during summer :)

matt020
Posts: 195
Joined: Sun Sep 29, 2019 9:17 am
Location: West Australia

Re: Cooling TF cards in CD32

Post by matt020 » Mon Jun 15, 2020 4:41 pm

I suffered from heat problems with a TF330, which was unheard of! In West Australia, we experience constant mid to high 30's during our summers, and at times reach the 40's!!

I took a slightly different approach, and attached a fan to the top lid of the CD32 and had it sucking air in through the top vents, and over the TF330 card. I added heat sinks to the CPLD, ram chips, and 030 CPU. The fan sucked in and moved air all over the TF330 and the heat sinks helped move heat away from the chips.

I attached the fan to the lid of the CD32 using simply a hot glue gun. A bit of glue on each side, held it in place for 10 seconds or so, and it was attached. And its been that way since November 2019 (8 months now). I used a 12v 40mm thin fan, and connected it to the 5v line on the CD32 power socket. Why 5v? Well, I just didnt need the fan running at full rip. At 5v its enough to have the fan spinning with enough air moving over the TF330 and it runs stable. At 5v, a 12v fan is also very very quiet! I can move the power line from the 5v on the power socket to 12v if I ever need better air flow.

Clearance wise, with a 40mm thin fan, there's a stack of clearance. I have an ESP module connected for wifi. There are no issues.

Unfortunately I didn't take any pictures, but it's as I have described - I opened the CD32 case, took the top lid off, and hot glued a fan to the top where the air vents are. Boom! Cooling in effect!

Danoo
Posts: 128
Joined: Wed Jan 29, 2020 1:25 pm
Location: Queensland, Australia

Re: Cooling TF cards in CD32

Post by Danoo » Mon Jun 15, 2020 11:11 pm

Thanks for the info @matt020 that sounds like a very good solution :idea: , it would certainly be a lot less coin than installing air conditioning. My own lab / workshop / gaming / etc etc is situated in a 15 x 6 m fully lined shed separate from the main house. It does get a little warm in there during the summer. ;)

sugar
Posts: 71
Joined: Sat Apr 20, 2019 10:28 pm

Re: Cooling TF cards in CD32

Post by sugar » Thu Jun 25, 2020 12:40 pm

I've been fannying about with the TF overheating and this fan placement seems to be ok to cool both the CPU and the CPLDs. As there's a motherboard screw close by I'm thinking of 3d printing a mount that could be attached there.
0F7832E1-8D9F-4834-9D49-C2E58EEAE4CD.jpeg
0F7832E1-8D9F-4834-9D49-C2E58EEAE4CD.jpeg (649.46 KiB) Viewed 2937 times

Higgy
Posts: 147
Joined: Tue Apr 23, 2019 8:05 pm
Location: Somerset

Re: Cooling TF cards in CD32

Post by Higgy » Thu Jun 25, 2020 8:31 pm

So we have hit 30 deg C here in the UK. Baby monitor is recording 28 in daughter's room.
I was on my 3rd Elude 060 demo (their demos push hard) at 75mhz with case shut and I got some stuttering in gfx and sound.
I turned everything off and waited 15mins. Going back to the demo and running another 2 more at 75mhz with case open it was all ok.
So I think I was seeing heat related issues. CLPDs were giving off quite some heat. So a 10 deg ambient temp increase over my earlier tests make quite a lot of difference.
The A1200 will probably suffer more in this high heat.

sugar
Posts: 71
Joined: Sat Apr 20, 2019 10:28 pm

Re: Cooling TF cards in CD32

Post by sugar » Fri Jun 26, 2020 3:20 pm

I did some sketching today and sketched this. Will need to print it to see how much fine tuning it needs but should be better than the cardboard and tape thing I have at the moment :-D
Attachments
cd32_fan_sketch_1.png
cd32_fan_sketch_1.png (175.81 KiB) Viewed 2867 times

sugar
Posts: 71
Joined: Sat Apr 20, 2019 10:28 pm

Re: Cooling TF cards in CD32

Post by sugar » Sun Jul 05, 2020 8:42 am

Higgy wrote:
Wed Jul 01, 2020 10:54 pm
I just swapped out the 5mm tall CPLD heatsinks for some 20x20x16 ones. Doing this has guaranteed the UK will not see 30 degs again this summer :lol:
What did you use to remove the old heat sinks? I've been considering doing the same and have some slightly bigger ones around but been afraid I'll break something if I forcefully remove the old sinks.

My first 3d fan stand print failed gloriously with support filament all over the place but will try some new designs later today. Tinkercad codeblocks is quite fun really.
Will be interesting to see if a relative silence can be achieved with adjusting the fan speed when the firmware is available. I have ordered a bunch of different CPU fans from China and also a power splitter but the Chinese keep cancelling my orders due to the shipping crisis which is quite annoying.

Higgy
Posts: 147
Joined: Tue Apr 23, 2019 8:05 pm
Location: Somerset

Re: Cooling TF cards in CD32

Post by Higgy » Sun Jul 05, 2020 11:20 am

Is there an easy way to get pic on my mobile on here as an attachment? I keep having to turn on and use WinPC

I used dental floss. Then IPA to clean off glue.

(Photo will help) i have rotated the RAM CPLD heatsink so that the air flow from my CPU fan blows through the heat sink fins (so it is mounted at 45 degs).
The CPU feels cool so its now the CPLDs that get hot for me an. My finger tip says the RAM one is the hotter one.

They are just mounted 'loose' at the moment with Artic Silver thermal compound. Just incase we come up with a better solution or if the Rev 2 needs a patch wire as 16mm high heat sinks restrict access. I think 20mm high hest sinks would fit but will be close to case.

I am also toying with the idea of cutting a little slot in the front or underneath of my CD32 to allow access to the CF card. Underneather would be neater, then a strip of tape over the CF card to allow it to be pulled out (i use this technique on RPi3 where there is no microsd eject mechanism!).

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