Monitor recapping and low ESR

Tool suggestions, soldering tips, general useful electronics knowhow.
User avatar
sandord
Trusted Guru
Trusted Guru
Posts: 596
Joined: Mon Aug 13, 2018 10:08 pm
Location: The Netherlands
Contact:

Re: Monitor recapping and low ESR

Post by sandord » Mon Oct 08, 2018 6:10 pm

For example, let's look at the first to caps in my list:

p1.png
p1.png (126.65 KiB) Viewed 1217 times
p2.png
p2.png (129.47 KiB) Viewed 1217 times

As far as I can tell, both DF and impedance@100 kHz/+20C tell something about ESR, am I right?
But neither of them lists both, so that's why I was wondering how to compare the two.

Of course I might be completely off track here, trying to grasp all this :oops:

User avatar
exxos
Site Admin
Site Admin
Posts: 7616
Joined: Wed Aug 16, 2017 11:19 pm
Location: UK
Contact:

Re: Monitor recapping and low ESR

Post by exxos » Mon Oct 08, 2018 6:45 pm

Your trying to compare to many different things at once...

Some manufacturers will list the actual ESR value (in mR typically) but the only one you really need to take notice of his current rated in mA. Because the higher the current the lower the ESR anyway... You don't really need to know both figures.. Some manufacturers do quote both of them but not always..

Also physically larger capacitors have generally have a better ESR figure (given a similar voltage & uF specs) .. In particular with Panasonic they will do a standard version and a "L" (Long) version which will have better ESR figures (higher ripple current in mA).. So if you have the extra height you can use that one instead of the short version. Also mA (ripple current) is inherently higher the higher the capacitance value gets.

A Example what I mean is listed below.. This is comparing a Panasonic "M series" with a "S series" (this is probably not good as the S is a SMT part, but I'm just trying to point out the differences in series of capacitors and values)...

1.jpg
1.jpg (86.4 KiB) Viewed 1213 times
Where this basically shows a 470uF 25V capacitor with a ripple of 380mA.

2.jpg
2.jpg (140.72 KiB) Viewed 1213 times
And here we have same 225V 470uF, with a higher 480mA rating.

Maybe worth mentioning again actually, the SMT parts are generally bad ESR rating because they are physically small. And the 480mA (M series), will likely be physically larger giving better rating..

If that particular capacitor was twice the height, then the ripple rating would probably be something like 650mA just a example.

In any case, the higher that figure, the lower the ESR figure and the better the capacitor will be.. You really don't need to worry about anything else is if that figure is low then everything else should be good anyway.

Of course if you find a capacitor that is 2,000mA, though it is going to be a lot lower ESR figure and will generally be much better capacitor in all respects anyway.

It can get a rather complicated subject, really just only take notice of the mA figure.. Some manufacturers may list the actual resistance instead of the mA figure.. But this is generally one reason I like Panasonic as they are pretty consistent and just list the mA figure which makes life a lot easier... Trying to compare multiple things will just likey make you go insane :)
4MB STFM 1.44 FD- VELOCE+ 020 STE - 4MB STE 32MHz - STFM 16MHz - STM - MEGA ST - Falcon 030 CT60 - Atari 2600 - Atari 7800 - Gigafile - SD Floppy Emulator - PeST - HxC - CosmosEx - Ultrasatan - various clutter

https://www.exxoshost.co.uk/atari/ All my hardware guides - mods - games - STOS
https://www.exxoshost.co.uk/atari/last/storenew/ - All my hardware mods for sale - Please help support by making a purchase.

User avatar
sandord
Trusted Guru
Trusted Guru
Posts: 596
Joined: Mon Aug 13, 2018 10:08 pm
Location: The Netherlands
Contact:

Re: Monitor recapping and low ESR

Post by sandord » Mon Oct 08, 2018 9:34 pm

exxos wrote:
Mon Oct 08, 2018 6:45 pm
...
Thanks, everything is slowely becoming clearer now. You advice to focus on the ripple current is just what I needed and I can see why.

I can also see a clear correlation between Panasonic low ESR series and their ripple values in my list. I'll try to get the ripples of the rest of the caps as high as I can, without getting too extreme of course.

When I'm done with the recaps, I will post pictures and cap lists.

User avatar
sandord
Trusted Guru
Trusted Guru
Posts: 596
Joined: Mon Aug 13, 2018 10:08 pm
Location: The Netherlands
Contact:

Re: Monitor recapping and low ESR

Post by sandord » Wed Oct 24, 2018 10:43 pm

Aaargghh!! There are caps EVERYWHERE!!! :stars: :roll: :-x
Those bags aren't even half of them...

IMG_20181024_231856.jpg
IMG_20181024_231856.jpg (152.36 KiB) Viewed 1165 times

User avatar
exxos
Site Admin
Site Admin
Posts: 7616
Joined: Wed Aug 16, 2017 11:19 pm
Location: UK
Contact:

Re: Monitor recapping and low ESR

Post by exxos » Wed Oct 24, 2018 10:53 pm

sandord wrote:
Wed Oct 24, 2018 10:43 pm
Aaargghh!! There are caps EVERYWHERE!!! :stars: :roll: :-x
Those bags aren't even half of them...
I got a wall of caps ;)
4MB STFM 1.44 FD- VELOCE+ 020 STE - 4MB STE 32MHz - STFM 16MHz - STM - MEGA ST - Falcon 030 CT60 - Atari 2600 - Atari 7800 - Gigafile - SD Floppy Emulator - PeST - HxC - CosmosEx - Ultrasatan - various clutter

https://www.exxoshost.co.uk/atari/ All my hardware guides - mods - games - STOS
https://www.exxoshost.co.uk/atari/last/storenew/ - All my hardware mods for sale - Please help support by making a purchase.

User avatar
sandord
Trusted Guru
Trusted Guru
Posts: 596
Joined: Mon Aug 13, 2018 10:08 pm
Location: The Netherlands
Contact:

Re: Monitor recapping and low ESR

Post by sandord » Wed Oct 24, 2018 11:10 pm

exxos wrote:
Wed Oct 24, 2018 10:53 pm
I got a wall of caps ;)
:shock:

Actually, I'm a bit jealous. There's something about caps. I don't know. I just want to buy them. Lots.

By the way, did you know that Chuck Norris can replace any cap with his fingers?

User avatar
exxos
Site Admin
Site Admin
Posts: 7616
Joined: Wed Aug 16, 2017 11:19 pm
Location: UK
Contact:

Re: Monitor recapping and low ESR

Post by exxos » Thu Oct 25, 2018 10:25 am

sandord wrote:
Wed Oct 24, 2018 11:10 pm
:shock:

Actually, I'm a bit jealous. There's something about caps. I don't know. I just want to buy them. Lots.
viewtopic.php?f=32&t=126

Plus new shelfs in the bedroom for storing multiple other boxes now , I can't find anything anymore :roll:
4MB STFM 1.44 FD- VELOCE+ 020 STE - 4MB STE 32MHz - STFM 16MHz - STM - MEGA ST - Falcon 030 CT60 - Atari 2600 - Atari 7800 - Gigafile - SD Floppy Emulator - PeST - HxC - CosmosEx - Ultrasatan - various clutter

https://www.exxoshost.co.uk/atari/ All my hardware guides - mods - games - STOS
https://www.exxoshost.co.uk/atari/last/storenew/ - All my hardware mods for sale - Please help support by making a purchase.

User avatar
IngoQ
Site Admin
Site Admin
Posts: 816
Joined: Tue Aug 22, 2017 8:38 am
Location: Germany

Re: Monitor recapping and low ESR

Post by IngoQ » Thu Oct 25, 2018 4:35 pm

I bought Panasonic low-ESR caps for 80 EURs a couple of weeks ago, just to stock up again... I know how you feel ;) It is actually quite nice to be able to spontaneously recap something on a sunday :)
Ingo :geek:

| Atari 1040STE@32MHz | Amiga 1200 (ACA1220) | Atari 800XL (U1MB, SIDE2) | Atari 130XL (Sophia DVI) | C64 (1541 Ultimate II, Rev3 RFMod Replacement) | TI 99/4A (F18A, 32k, FlashROM 99) | Sinclair ZX Spectrum 128 (Stereo, DivMMC) | Amstrad CPC664 (512k, M4 Wifi) | ... |

User avatar
sandord
Trusted Guru
Trusted Guru
Posts: 596
Joined: Mon Aug 13, 2018 10:08 pm
Location: The Netherlands
Contact:

Re: Monitor recapping and low ESR

Post by sandord » Thu Oct 25, 2018 6:21 pm

IngoQ wrote:
Thu Oct 25, 2018 4:35 pm
I bought Panasonic low-ESR caps for 80 EURs a couple of weeks ago, just to stock up again... I know how you feel ;) It is actually quite nice to be able to spontaneously recap something on a sunday :)
Yeah, that's really nice!
I'm currently recapping a couple of monitors and I ordered extra for the same reason.

User avatar
sandord
Trusted Guru
Trusted Guru
Posts: 596
Joined: Mon Aug 13, 2018 10:08 pm
Location: The Netherlands
Contact:

Re: Monitor recapping and low ESR

Post by sandord » Fri Oct 26, 2018 8:40 am

I finished the recapping of my 1084-D2 and the picture is rock solid again! This is so rewarding, I'm afraid I'm already addicted.

There are three monitors on the line so I won't be finished any time soon. The next candidate is a 1084-P1 (for which I already have the caps) and then two SC1224s.

Post Reply